Microsoft Sharepoint Support in Fargo?
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Also to add, I don't hate Microsoft, I hate Aruba
MS gets a bad rap for some of their products, but they offer a great streamlined solution (With my only complaint being there push for IPv6 which is, absolutely blasphemous)
I am just upset at the lack of education/training that not only this particular rep had, but 4 others.
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tjamz;179445 wrote:
To call it a temp agency is a little harsh. They are a subcontracted business partner/employee development firm. Its not like you can be a complete idiot and get a job there, you do have to know a little about computers, pass certifications, etc... For many it is a foot in the door to get on at Microsoft. It is lower paying than Microsoft of course, but their CSR's work with teams from MS to solve problems. Basically they are tier 1 customer service (maybe tier 2 even) and then as problems get escalated or go unresolved, the Microsoft CSR's take over.Think about this: Many people who contact the help desk have overly simple problems that can be solved by anyone with a flowchart. Why pay your top creative problem solving people to do menial jobs when someone with basic computer knowledge can do it for a LOT less money?
he speaks the truth, trust me lol
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Hrmmm, I'd like to see the credentials of those certifications then.
For certain the person whom he spoke to (assuming he passed even a basic 270-90 test) would understand certain credentials are on a SBS (IE: All FSMO roles)
SBS Server has a plethora of questions on the 270-93, it would be fairly difficult to pass one's exam without basic knowledge of this.
I will have to doubt that they have to pass certifications, perhaps supervisors, but certainly not the support professionals (or at least once again, these 4)
Certifications mean nothing, I have (had let me rephrase) employees in the past, with no education, no certifcation, and half of them work for AT&T now as a part of an MPLS design team. However, when working with a company's product, and representing them it is vital to recieve those certifications.
I'm a licensed Cisco dealer, therefore, I must keep my CCIE every 2 years, and as a matter of fact they change these tests quite often; August 15th the exam will be entirely different.
Do not try to convince me what volt is and what volt isn't, the highest "skill level" set that they find are .Net developers - a colleague of mine was a recruiter for them for 5 years until he left for Teksystems, and now works with Bucher Christensen Consulting, Cargill, and EDS.
Volt is like every other IT recruiter out there, trying to fill a gap in the IT employment, which is nessecary, however (not all the time) but sometimes, just like any other industry, they tend to over exert themselves, and place the need of the client (in this case Microsoft) before the quality of the candidate.
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Upon further reading, and evaluation of your comment Tjamz, I agree with you to a certain extent. They are tier 1, however, they are being marketed as different.
They are being marketed out to these clients whom are paying hefty contract fee's as support professionals, when they are far from that. Either A) Increase the training that Volt recieves, so that the client can feel the blowback of this regiment, or B) Offer different support locale for the clients
Aruba has a done fine job of this in the past including of there streamlined products (Vast cry from what cisco's latest offering is, particularly in the core layer) and as for there support, they are very blunt in what each how you would call "tier" is capable of.
I feel the pain for the client of Northland systems, when they are paying x amount of money for contract and support fee's on top of there licensing. They expect results, and they shouldn't have to pay the firm that I represent on top of what they have already committed to, to solve a problem that is specifically within there regiments.
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I'll let Irish speak to this, he came up through Volt and now works for Microsoft. My brother-in-law currently works for Volt (w/ a 4 year MIS degree).
Yes, their services are being marketed to clients who pay hefty fees, but you also have to realize what I said before that MOST help desk type calls can be handled by ANYONE w/ an ounce of common sense and the ability to read a diagnostic flowchart. Sometimes people call in with more complex issues. It is at this point in time that the escalation occurs. The people in the call escalation areas are the ones more likely to be certified and have a more in depth understanding of the products they are assisting on. There will be times when even they cannot handle the issue and the call gets escalated even higher...possibly to Microsoft employees who will attempt a more in depth assessment and diagnosis. Like any other CS department there are going to be times when they can't answer the questions OR when their customers just don't have the knowledge to understand what they are being asked and therefore don't do what they are told to do...and then the issue doesn't get resolved. Another possibility is that someone in the lower tiers failed to try a process that they should have done....the tiers above them assume that it has been tried already because it is standard protocol, but for whatever reason it wasn't done. The upper tier people skip over that portion assuming it has already been tried when in reality a Tier 1 person may have been able to answer the question if they had presented it....of course it is still possible that when the client called, they immediately asked to speak to someone higher up so steps may have been skipped there as well. In a perfect world, a flow-chart and the ability to read would be all that is needed at a help desk...but also in that world the help desk wouldn't be needed since everything would be simple and nothing would ever mess up.
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tjamz;179474 wrote:
I'll let Irish speak to this, he came up through Volt and now works for Microsoft. My brother-in-law currently works for Volt (w/ a 4 year MIS degree).Yes, their services are being marketed to clients who pay hefty fees, but you also have to realize what I said before that MOST help desk type calls can be handled by ANYONE w/ an ounce of common sense and the ability to read a diagnostic flowchart. Sometimes people call in with more complex issues. It is at this point in time that the escalation occurs. The people in the call escalation areas are the ones more likely to be certified and have a more in depth understanding of the products they are assisting on. There will be times when even they cannot handle the issue and the call gets escalated even higher...possibly to Microsoft employees who will attempt a more in depth assessment and diagnosis. Like any other CS department there are going to be times when they can't answer the questions OR when their customers just don't have the knowledge to understand what they are being asked and therefore don't do what they are told to do...and then the issue doesn't get resolved. Another possibility is that someone in the lower tiers failed to try a process that they should have done....the tiers above them assume that it has been tried already because it is standard protocol, but for whatever reason it wasn't done. The upper tier people skip over that portion assuming it has already been tried when in reality a Tier 1 person may have been able to answer the question if they had presented it....of course it is still possible that when the client called, they immediately asked to speak to someone higher up so steps may have been skipped there as well. In a perfect world, a flow-chart and the ability to read would be all that is needed at a help desk...but also in that world the help desk wouldn't be needed since everything would be simple and nothing would ever mess up.
I understand how a help desk works, I been in this business longer then you imagine. I been in it before ATM, working for various telecom industries. You do not need to explain to me how it works, I know how it SHOULD work, and volt does not do that. If you want a standard tier 1 call, let us go back to this particular example once again, when the question of "What operating system is it?" and they answered SBS 2003, well obviously the guy has not a god damn clue of anything of the innards of it. He should've chucked it on over, perhaps saving maybe an hour or 2 there, then idiot #2 came in, idiot #3, and idiot #4, sure the REMOTE possibility came that #2-4, ASSUMED that something was covered, but that just shows blatant inexperience, anyone in the IT industry, whether your desktop support, helpdesk, admin, IS manager - YOU never EVER assume, you work from the group up. Hell its the foundation of the OSI layer (However practical that is)
I am sure your brother in law, and irish, are fine employees of the company and represent them well. I myself use to work for a company similar to volt back in the telecom days - until I realized, the only way to make money in god blessed America and its capitalistic ways - is to be in business for yourself. Which was the best decision I have ever made in my life.
I don't stand for particular business models and practicies, and volt seems to be following these off not only this experience, but others, I tried finding a .NET developer several months ago, Volt found and sent me 15 candidates, NONE of them worked with it before, ever. How completely idiotic is that? I payed volt great money for there "excellence in service, dedication, and human resource management" what I recieved was just pitiful garbage. I had better luck posting an add on craigslist.org and reading through resumes myself, which takes my valuable time.
I don't like reading resumes, they bore me to death, that is why I attempted to use volt, and several other agencies, so that bad taste of recruiters are left with me never to be shaken from.
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BrianGriffin81;179477 wrote:
I understand how a help desk works, I been in this business longer then you imagine. I been in it before ATM, working for various telecom industries. You do not need to explain to me how it works, I know how it SHOULD work, and volt does not do that. If you want a standard tier 1 call, let us go back to this particular example once again, when the question of "What operating system is it?" and they answered SBS 2003, well obviously the guy has not a god damn clue of anything of the innards of it. He should've chucked it on over, perhaps saving maybe an hour or 2 there, then idiot #2 came in, idiot #3, and idiot #4, sure the REMOTE possibility came that #2-4, ASSUMED that something was covered, but that just shows blatant inexperience, anyone in the IT industry, whether your desktop support, helpdesk, admin, IS manager - YOU never EVER assume, you work from the group up. Hell its the foundation of the OSI layer (However practical that is)I am sure your brother in law, and irish, are fine employees of the company and represent them well. I myself use to work for a company similar to volt back in the telecom days - until I realized, the only way to make money in god blessed America and its capitalistic ways - is to be in business for yourself. Which was the best decision I have ever made in my life.
I don't stand for particular business models and practicies, and volt seems to be following these off not only this experience, but others, I tried finding a .NET developer several months ago, Volt found and sent me 15 candidates, NONE of them worked with it before, ever. How completely idiotic is that? I payed volt great money for there "excellence in service, dedication, and human resource management" what I recieved was just pitiful garbage. I had better luck posting an add on craigslist.org and reading through resumes myself, which takes my valuable time.
I don't like reading resumes, they bore me to death, that is why I attempted to use volt, and several other agencies, so that bad taste of recruiters are left with me never to be shaken from.
First of all let me give you some facts. I worked for volt/vmc for 5 months before being hired on as an FTE at microsoft. I am currently a Tech lead. Our VMC team is considered first line of support and they do a damn good job. On average they escalate less than 3% of cases per period. Volt does an excellent job working on location at MS Fargo. If you want some real information on Sharepoint teams coming to Fargo PM me, I would be more than welcome to help you out. That team has grown vastly with Full time microsoft employees in fargo NOT volt/VMC.
I love how you compared every employee to the ones Volt sent you. Great reading! :icon_scratch:
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BrianGriffin81;179477 wrote:
I tried finding a .NET developer several months ago, Volt found and sent me 15 candidates, NONE of them worked with it before, ever. How completely idiotic is that? I payed volt great money for there "excellence in service, dedication, and human resource management" what I recieved was just pitiful garbage. I had better luck posting an add on craigslist.org and reading through resumes myself, which takes my valuable time.I don't like reading resumes, they bore me to death, that is why I attempted to use volt, and several other agencies, so that bad taste of recruiters are left with me never to be shaken from.
I'm sure that if you've been in "the business" as long as you're implying that you understand that IT/Technology recruiting stinks in general. I've done a bunch of MS FTE interview loops (out in redmond) and these are all people that have gotten past a phone screen and have been flown to see us on our dime. We still can't hire 80-90% of them. If you can solve the recruiting problem in general, MS will pay you whatever you want to solve it for us
Finding good people is hard.. i still get mails from placement agencies asking if I want to work for MS in Redmond In any case, I don't think it's fair to suggest that Volt is some hive of villany or incompetance based on you assuming stuff about the composition of a support team you had no direct experience with, and of your experience trying to get a "good" candidate referred to you.
As an aside, we all have bad days at work in this field, but typically more seasoned professionals are able to remain on task and constructive even when they're working with less than perfect people or organizations. Your posts have been full of lots of steam and a bit of braggadacio; you never know what guy reading this might be your next client until they put two and two together and decide to take their business elsewhere.
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BrianGriffin81;179469 wrote:
I'm a licensed Cisco dealer, therefore, I must keep my CCIE every 2 years, and as a matter of fact they change these tests quite often; August 15th the exam will be entirely different.What's your Number?
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integra_gsr98;179488 wrote:
What's your Number?Is your phone call referring to the needs of a CCIE? If so, I will give you the number to our dispatcher, and depending on your situation, Jayan (CCIE #18350) will take care of it, if it is voice, and myself on data (CCIE # 18485)
888-412-5546 is our (outsourced) dispatch office
If for whatever reason you need my personal contact information, feel free to PM me and I shall reply - please keep it confidential. Which I find so far, after reading some various threads, will be quite difficult to do.
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Didn't you say you moved back to Minneapolis?
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integra_gsr98;179493 wrote:
Didn't you say you moved back to Minneapolis?Correct - that is the number of the dispatch office, that allocates all of our calls. Are we having a misunderstanding here of some sort?
You see, let me explain to you a simple business concept, instead of hiring a monkey to answer phone calls, why not hire a company (that doesn't need to be paid benefits, and on top of that, far cheaper) to dispatch out phone calls, this company also does this for various other companies amongst the north american continent.
Why don't you just call it, and go ahead and give them your information (after collecting your billing information) make sure to ask for a CCIE support, and like magic within 10-15 mins (due to our response time guarentee) one of us will give you a call, as a matter of fact, today is your lucky day - I will be that one.
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So you passed the routing and switching exam?
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Since were als on topic of, for whatever childish reason, doubting my geographical loaction - if you are a forum moderator, you should be able to take a look at oh say, the last 5 IP's that I've logged on as, and then go to a little known website called http://dnsstuff.com and it will give you all the information you want with their utilities, including a basic trace which should show you the hops I am coming from giving you a rough estimate.
I'm either in Minneapolis, or I got some really really really long fiber out from, Eagan, Plymouth, Downtown, and Bloomington.
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I have no issues with your geographical region except your last IP puts you in Fargo, weird.
Current one seems to be OK though.When did you pass your CCIE?
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integra_gsr98;179497 wrote:
So you passed the routing and switching exam?I'm assuming you mean the 350-001, last time I checked - yep, I did. I just gave you my CCIE #, use your TAC ID and verify for pete's sake.
I don't know what kind of background you have, but after August 15th - CCIE, CCNA, and CCNP (CCDA will be left alone) will be changed dramatically to more alter professional environment, consisting of what the CCIE mainly was (lab environment)
they will be taking a structure, similar to what MS uses - core and supplemental facilities to give greater aveneues, and specialties in particular products.
During your CCIE lab exam, they make you setup whatever network they desire (ATM, now MPLS) could be anything - you do it within the stipulation, bandwidth limitation, etc, of whatever they demand, then they break it. I am absolutely shuddering to see what they will do in any 8500 + Chasis + Sup 720 (seems to be the hot item vendors are pushing) kind of troubleshooting they will expect.
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integra_gsr98;179500 wrote:
I have no issues with your geographical region except your last IP puts you in Fargo, weird.
Current one seems to be OK though.When did you pass your CCIE?
Rephrase the question, originally pass my CCIE? Or the most recent time I was recertified?
Originally - 1999
Recertified - 2006
CCIE once again, requires you to do it every 2 years. I am seriously considering not doing it anymore, as I am partnered now and we are streamlining ourselves to be an Aruba partner, my CCIE will be moot point to our vendors.
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So you passed in 1999? What was your original number?
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integra_gsr98;179503 wrote:
So you passed in 1999? What was your original number?Christ, is this an interrogation?
Back in 2001 - they changed the way how Cisco professionals were monitored. It use to be a 4 digit number - and when I recertified in 2002 - I was given my current number - also because I was self employed and we were a cisco partner we came on a different standard.
I am sure I could find my ORIGINAL card somewhere, but really? Wouldn't it be far easier for you just to go on, put your TAC in, type my badge, and pull up the information?
Or rather, call the number I gave you, It really is insulting for people to basically, how I say, undermine your experience when I have gone through much in order to attain my status. I have given you the credentials and avenues to verify, please do so and then get back here. Thank you and have a great day.
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CCIE #18485 was ISSUED July 20, 2007. Sorry, try again. It was also issued to Benjamin Hill who took the SECURITY track, and not the Routing and Switching track. Hell, he even used a boot camp to get through the written test.
CCIE numbers do not change. If you were issued a 4 digit number and recert, you reclaim your 4 digit number. They do not recycle them, as they are continually incrementing.
They don't care who you work for, whether you work for a partner, an ISP, a telco, whatever. Your number is assigned in the order the certs are handed out.
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