Illegal Immigration
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You prob know this, but this has nothing to do with the new AZ law since it's not enacted yet. It was the Feds that detained him.
The new AZ law actually says that a drivers license IS a valid form of identification (line 39 of the bill).
It will be interesting to hear what the feds had to say about this Abdon guys detention. Everything I've been able to find just tells one side of the story, it doesn't seem legit.
thrash;310280 wrote:
Which doesn't mean jack shit since there are tons of illegals with drivers licenses.Were you required to show your birth certificate to get your license? You certainly aren't in many states.
I didn't say "ID". I said birth certificate. AZ will not consider your ND drivers license as valid if they don't think the ND licensing process does sufficient due dilligence to show legal resident status before issuing a license.
They have already thrown a US Citizen in jail in AZ.. a trucker who had a DL/CDL from a state they didn't "trust" to do good enough background checks.
His wife had to go and dig up his real birth certificate before they would let this guy out of jail. For what? For being guilty of being brown?
AZ [and the USA in general] is in a bad situation; intelligent people don't deny that. But this cure may be worse than the poison. There are certainly better ways of dealing with the issue than requiring all Americans to be able to hand over birth records at any time. Thats some soviet union bullshit right there.
DaveH
'94 Supra- 7.77 @ 176mph -
DaveH;310292 wrote:
The new AZ law actually says that a drivers license IS a valid form of identification (line 39 of the bill).13 ARTICLE 8. ENFORCEMENT OF IMMIGRATION LAWS
14 11-1051. Cooperation and assistance in enforcement of
15 immigration laws; indemnification
16 A. NO OFFICIAL OR AGENCY OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR
17 OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS STATE MAY LIMIT OR RESTRICT THE
18 ENFORCEMENT OF FEDERAL IMMIGRATION LAWS TO LESS THAN THE FULL EXTENT
19 PERMITTED BY FEDERAL LAW.
20 B. FOR ANY LAWFUL CONTACT MADE BY A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIAL OR A LAW
21 ENFORCEMENT AGENCY OF THIS STATE OR A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIAL OR A LAW
22 ENFORCEMENT AGENCY OF A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF
23 THIS STATE WHERE REASONABLE SUSPICION EXISTS THAT THE PERSON IS AN ALIEN WHO
24 IS UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES, A REASONABLE ATTEMPT SHALL BE
25 MADE, WHEN PRACTICABLE, TO DETERMINE THE IMMIGRATION STATUS OF THE PERSON,
26 EXCEPT IF THE DETERMINATION MAY HINDER OR OBSTRUCT AN INVESTIGATION. ANY
27 PERSON WHO IS ARRESTED SHALL HAVE THE PERSON'S IMMIGRATION STATUS DETERMINED
28 BEFORE THE PERSON IS RELEASED. THE PERSON'S IMMIGRATION STATUS SHALL BE
29 VERIFIED WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT PURSUANT TO 8 UNITED STATES CODE SECTION
30 1373(c). A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIAL OR AGENCY OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY,
31 CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS STATE MAY NOT SOLELY
32 CONSIDER RACE, COLOR OR NATIONAL ORIGIN IN IMPLEMENTING THE REQUIREMENTS OF
33 THIS SUBSECTION EXCEPT TO THE EXTENT PERMITTED BY THE UNITED STATES OR
34 ARIZONA CONSTITUTION. **A PERSON IS PRESUMED TO NOT BE AN ALIEN WHO IS
35 UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES IF THE PERSON PROVIDES TO THE LAW
36 ENFORCEMENT OFFICER OR AGENCY ANY OF THE FOLLOWING:
37 1. A VALID ARIZONA DRIVER LICENSE.
38 2. A VALID ARIZONA NONOPERATING IDENTIFICATION LICENSE.
39 3. A VALID TRIBAL ENROLLMENT CARD OR OTHER FORM OF TRIBAL
40 IDENTIFICATION.
41 4. IF THE ENTITY REQUIRES PROOF OF LEGAL PRESENCE IN THE UNITED STATES
42 BEFORE ISSUANCE, ANY VALID UNITED STATES FEDERAL, STATE OR LOCAL GOVERNMENT
43 ISSUED IDENTIFICATION. -
That was the original bill Chuck, the drivers license verbage is on line 39 on the bill with the amendments on it.
Trafik Jamz;310294 wrote:
34 ARIZONA CONSTITUTION. **A PERSON IS PRESUMED TO NOT BE AN ALIEN WHO IS
35 UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES IF THE PERSON PROVIDES TO THE LAW
36 ENFORCEMENT OFFICER OR AGENCY ANY OF THE FOLLOWING:
*37 1. A VALID ARIZONA DRIVER LICENSE.
38 2. A VALID ARIZONA NONOPERATING IDENTIFICATION LICENSE.
39 3. A VALID TRIBAL ENROLLMENT CARD OR OTHER FORM OF TRIBAL
40 **IDENTIFICATION.
DaveH
'94 Supra- 7.77 @ 176mph -
thrash;310280 wrote:
Which doesn't mean jack shit since there are tons of illegals with drivers licenses.Were you required to show your birth certificate to get your license? You certainly aren't in many states.
I didn't say "ID". I said birth certificate. AZ will not consider your ND drivers license as valid if they don't think the ND licensing process does sufficient due dilligence to show legal resident status before issuing a license.
They have already thrown a US Citizen in jail in AZ.. a trucker who had a DL/CDL from a state they didn't "trust" to do good enough background checks.
His wife had to go and dig up his real birth certificate before they would let this guy out of jail. For what? For being guilty of being brown?
AZ [and the USA in general] is in a bad situation; intelligent people don't deny that. But this cure may be worse than the poison. There are certainly better ways of dealing with the issue than requiring all Americans to be able to hand over birth records at any time. Thats some soviet union bullshit right there.
Your a whiny bitch, how fucking hard is it to carry around their green card? You carry your passport when your in another country right?
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Bp-08;310298 wrote:
Your a whiny bitch, how fucking hard is it to carry around their green card? You carry your passport when your in another country right?What if they are CITIZENS (which is exactly what the guy in the example he gave was)? As in lived here their whole lives and are truly American Citizens. What he is getting at is until you can PROVE you are a citizen you can be held on suspicion of being an illegal until you prove your innocence. The ONLY way to do this is via birth certificate as it isn't all that hard to obtain a drivers license, even if you are an illegal alien.
The WHOLE PREMISE of this society is that you are innocent until PROVEN guilty, not guilty until you can prove otherwise. That (I believe) is what thrash is getting at.
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Bp-08;310318 wrote:
You're held in Jail until you go to court.......But only if there is just cause to hold you. Demanding paperwork and/or putting up a kill zone fence (to keep others out or us in) makes us no better than a communist state. And here YOU thought I was the crazy liberal on this site....
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DaveH;310297 wrote:
That was the original bill Chuck, the drivers license verbage is on line 39 on the bill with the amendments on it.do you have the updated bill language that talks about what they do with NON Arizona licenses?
I don't see non-AZ licenses mentioned.
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Bp-08;310298 wrote:
Your a whiny bitch, how fucking hard is it to carry around their green card? You carry your passport when your in another country right?
You are entering a world of pain.
Before I make it amply clear why you have no business getting in an interweb argument with someone as awesome as me, I'll give you the opportunity to back off.
Just respond to this message with the following text:
"Sorry dude, I am not normally so fucking stupid so as to walk my barely coherent ramblings infront of the intellectual freight train of a thrash-is-explaining-politics post. I was drunk posting. I'll probably fuck up and do it again, but i am apologizing for this time."
Do that ... and you won't have to have your e-shit e-ruined any e-further.... E-bitch.
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I'd like to report thrash's last post.....FOR BEING AWESOME!
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